I have an old boss of mine at a doggy daycare in 2014 or so to thank for having a CD copy of PND in the dog van at all times. I don't even think he ever listened to anything on it besides Randy Dandy-Oh but the first time I listened through it I was like "hell yeah".
Where did I go after? To Spotify of course. I sat at my laptop and listened to everything I could. I can't imagine the era 10 years before that, hoping the comic book/record store at the mall had ANYTHING by this mystical Canadian band called The Dreadnoughts.
As much as people love to demonize the service (and as much as I wish it would pay the artists I love more), there's immense value in discoverability. Cracking the algorithm is the hardest part.
I've found tons of bands that I now love (Chewie being a recent example) due to Spotify saying "hey you listened to this band for 14 hours last week, maybe try this one song from another band."
I hope enough of those fan discoveries turn into profitable consumers for artists, but it's sad to realize that the vast majority of people that consume music (from Spotify in particular) are pretty passive in their support for the bands they listen to.
Our thoughts exactly. The discovery algorithms used to be quite poor but now they are getting so much better. Obviously there is some joy in doing the work yourself but ultimately in a world drowning in content that is getting harder and harder.
And all of this can still mean that we should push the platforms to pay more, and to do what they need to do in order make the funds available.
This is particularly interesting as I discovered you by completely other means – namely, Googling lyrics for some trad shanties, seeing the songs credited to you, finally after 4 or 5 iterations of this deigning to look up these "Dreadnoughts" on YouTube, running quickly to Bandcamp, and checking out with a massive cartful of music. Nary a spot ified. But YouTube has, in the past, performed the function you describe above of throwing something my way which I wouldn't otherwise have come across – a more efficient way of finding new music than hearing something in passing, scribbling down what lyrics I could make out, Googling them, and seeking options from there.
I suppose I'm part of the problem, in that I refuse to get a Spotify subscription, and even access YouTube with an effective adblocker, but I hope to compensate for that by paying real money for music I know I'm going to listen to a lot. Slightly better than my former habit of buying used CDs, which of course didn't benefit the artists at all, aside from *possibly* encouraging some people to buy more new CDs because they knew they could sell them on. Remember Charlie's on Granville? That's the real thing I hold a grudge against Spotify and iTunes for: nowhere like Charlie's anymore for those on limited budgets to acquire music (vs renting it) legitimately.
Wise thoughts all around. Of course there are many ways for people to make these digital connections and Spotify is only one. It's probably best, if we're going to do this in the capitalist sort of way, that there are these multiple competitors, and we can only hope that somehow they will all be pushed towards the most humane possible model. Also it is interesting to compare what you used to spend per year on those used CDs versus a music subscription. In USD one year of Spotify is $120 and you get access to like three quarters of the music recorded in the entire history of the world, but personally there were years and I would drop $400 on those CDs, which as you say benefited the artists zero.
I wouldn't be here with an opinion if Spotify hadn't decided that a playlist with the Longest Johns and Flogging Molly needed "Roll Northumbria" added to it. Hooked me from the opening chords. This year Spotify informed me I've enjoyed 53 genres of music. That's Spotify for me. A doorway. I spent a few years trying to make a living selling artwork on various platforms. The internet is a cheap and noisy place to do business, with a corresponding lack of respect for what goes into creative content. These days I have a day job that lets me budget for better art supplies which includes supporting artists that provide the music in my studio. Spotify is what it is. When you make it work for you as a listener, it is beautiful and provides access to music you would never have found anywhere else.
Yeah I generally agree. These algorithms used to be pretty bad but these days Spotify's "discover" playlist nets me about 5-6 new amazing undiscovered songs a month. It is getting better and better at this.
Since I discovered the Dreadnoughts a few years ago I have pretty much listened to nothing else, except for a brief affair with Arlo Guthrie backed by the U of KY Symphony Orchestra, and the occasional wastewater treatment lecture. I tried Spotify because Apple Music didn’t have any Zydepunks, as recommended by you, but Spotify is weird and I don’t like it for a reason I can’t quite articulate. So Apple Music it is. What I want to know is, have I made it possible for you to buy your second boat yet? I only listen to the Dreadnoughts on my 45 minute commute every day and when I am awake. Should I ramp it up a bit?
Hey, fair enough! And yes, we each just own the one boat now, so if you could double or triple your listening time that would be really nice. Thank you!
Do you think that Bandcamp is a better model than Spotify? Seeing the comments, it seems like a lot of people are using Spotify for music discovery, but I think I use YouTube for that. I can usually find what I'm looking for on Bandcamp. It's been years, but I think I found you all that way.
I have an old boss of mine at a doggy daycare in 2014 or so to thank for having a CD copy of PND in the dog van at all times. I don't even think he ever listened to anything on it besides Randy Dandy-Oh but the first time I listened through it I was like "hell yeah".
Where did I go after? To Spotify of course. I sat at my laptop and listened to everything I could. I can't imagine the era 10 years before that, hoping the comic book/record store at the mall had ANYTHING by this mystical Canadian band called The Dreadnoughts.
As much as people love to demonize the service (and as much as I wish it would pay the artists I love more), there's immense value in discoverability. Cracking the algorithm is the hardest part.
I've found tons of bands that I now love (Chewie being a recent example) due to Spotify saying "hey you listened to this band for 14 hours last week, maybe try this one song from another band."
I hope enough of those fan discoveries turn into profitable consumers for artists, but it's sad to realize that the vast majority of people that consume music (from Spotify in particular) are pretty passive in their support for the bands they listen to.
Anyway yeah. Spotify
Our thoughts exactly. The discovery algorithms used to be quite poor but now they are getting so much better. Obviously there is some joy in doing the work yourself but ultimately in a world drowning in content that is getting harder and harder.
And all of this can still mean that we should push the platforms to pay more, and to do what they need to do in order make the funds available.
This is particularly interesting as I discovered you by completely other means – namely, Googling lyrics for some trad shanties, seeing the songs credited to you, finally after 4 or 5 iterations of this deigning to look up these "Dreadnoughts" on YouTube, running quickly to Bandcamp, and checking out with a massive cartful of music. Nary a spot ified. But YouTube has, in the past, performed the function you describe above of throwing something my way which I wouldn't otherwise have come across – a more efficient way of finding new music than hearing something in passing, scribbling down what lyrics I could make out, Googling them, and seeking options from there.
I suppose I'm part of the problem, in that I refuse to get a Spotify subscription, and even access YouTube with an effective adblocker, but I hope to compensate for that by paying real money for music I know I'm going to listen to a lot. Slightly better than my former habit of buying used CDs, which of course didn't benefit the artists at all, aside from *possibly* encouraging some people to buy more new CDs because they knew they could sell them on. Remember Charlie's on Granville? That's the real thing I hold a grudge against Spotify and iTunes for: nowhere like Charlie's anymore for those on limited budgets to acquire music (vs renting it) legitimately.
Wise thoughts all around. Of course there are many ways for people to make these digital connections and Spotify is only one. It's probably best, if we're going to do this in the capitalist sort of way, that there are these multiple competitors, and we can only hope that somehow they will all be pushed towards the most humane possible model. Also it is interesting to compare what you used to spend per year on those used CDs versus a music subscription. In USD one year of Spotify is $120 and you get access to like three quarters of the music recorded in the entire history of the world, but personally there were years and I would drop $400 on those CDs, which as you say benefited the artists zero.
I wouldn't be here with an opinion if Spotify hadn't decided that a playlist with the Longest Johns and Flogging Molly needed "Roll Northumbria" added to it. Hooked me from the opening chords. This year Spotify informed me I've enjoyed 53 genres of music. That's Spotify for me. A doorway. I spent a few years trying to make a living selling artwork on various platforms. The internet is a cheap and noisy place to do business, with a corresponding lack of respect for what goes into creative content. These days I have a day job that lets me budget for better art supplies which includes supporting artists that provide the music in my studio. Spotify is what it is. When you make it work for you as a listener, it is beautiful and provides access to music you would never have found anywhere else.
Yeah I generally agree. These algorithms used to be pretty bad but these days Spotify's "discover" playlist nets me about 5-6 new amazing undiscovered songs a month. It is getting better and better at this.
Reality. What a concept......
Since I discovered the Dreadnoughts a few years ago I have pretty much listened to nothing else, except for a brief affair with Arlo Guthrie backed by the U of KY Symphony Orchestra, and the occasional wastewater treatment lecture. I tried Spotify because Apple Music didn’t have any Zydepunks, as recommended by you, but Spotify is weird and I don’t like it for a reason I can’t quite articulate. So Apple Music it is. What I want to know is, have I made it possible for you to buy your second boat yet? I only listen to the Dreadnoughts on my 45 minute commute every day and when I am awake. Should I ramp it up a bit?
Hey, fair enough! And yes, we each just own the one boat now, so if you could double or triple your listening time that would be really nice. Thank you!
Do you think that Bandcamp is a better model than Spotify? Seeing the comments, it seems like a lot of people are using Spotify for music discovery, but I think I use YouTube for that. I can usually find what I'm looking for on Bandcamp. It's been years, but I think I found you all that way.